Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

General discussion about the NoScript extension for Firefox
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PetiteNerd

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by PetiteNerd » Sun May 03, 2009 1:51 pm

Well you know I have to hand it to you Giorgio that you never passed the blame / pointed the finger or slung any mud, well only the same as others where slinging BUT you apologized and in my books that shows an honest person :) person with a conscience

Your forgiven well by me and family at least

"Let him who is without sin cast the first stone..."
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Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 2:31 pm

Giorgio Maone wrote:The apology comes together with the release notes page, opened automatically when you install or update NoScript.


You update so frequently, the page opens so much, it's a bloody pop up at this point. You're the fire alarm that goes off when the wind blows - eventually it gets ignored and every now and then people peer around to make sure they're ok. So no matter HOW automatic it was, your self righteousness in assuming everyone will go there and read the one change to a page that people won't always read.

If they read the apology, they should have read also the announcement of the filterset (it was in the same box).
And yes, I read the changelog of any product I upgrade, even for those for which I need to go manually to the relevant page.


A. Frequency of updates is too high. I have a life. I'm not going to pore over every change log entry every day just 'cause you updated.

B. Apologies are something to be treated special. This isn't a regular occurrence. This isn't like employee of the month or something like that warrants a brief note. This is damned important because you broke trust not w/ only me, or someone foulmouth or whomever. You broke it en masse.

BTW, since some there also suggested that NoScript was too simple to require so many update, why didn't just check the changelog (or the code, for who's capable to)?


Because we trusted you were doing the right thing and just keeping us ahead of the pack. We assumed you were fighting against some jerks who were skirting noscript. I'm a programmer too. I know it's not easy. So why should you assume everyone thinks like you?

The only reason I'm replying here and not doing more to expose this? It is is the amount of effort that a) will give ME closure for you thinking this such a minor thing and b) it'll clear up those on the line of, "eh.. is it ok?"

gg you self righteous jerk
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Giorgio Maone
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Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Giorgio Maone » Sun May 03, 2009 3:12 pm

@Guest (latest one):
You're quoting me out of context. I was answering to another guest, after linking for him another post where I stated clearly I think this was not a minor think at all, and definitely a very bad thing.
Then he asked specifically if I thought that users read the release notes when they update, and I answer yes.
I can't understand how you draw your conclusions about my intentions or me downplaying things from that.

Regarding the apologies, as I said I'm trying to come out with a blog entry between a forum post and an email answer.
However, putting my apologies well in evidence on the release notes page seemed and still seems to me the most honest choice for an immediate response, since it's the one having the best chances to reach the vast majority of my users, even the few ones who didn't hear about this controversy yet.
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Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 3:15 pm

Giorgio Maone wrote:However, putting my apologies well in evidence on the release notes page seemed and still seems to me the most honest ...


Redemption is not for everyone. You don't get to judge how you are redeemed.
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Frodo Fraggins

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Frodo Fraggins » Sun May 03, 2009 3:28 pm

I only use NS, as I guess I never saw the need for ABP as well. That being said I am extremely disappointed with Giorgio's actions. Once all this animosity dies down, I think Giorgio should do what he can to keep his financial needs separate from the addon. Either by periodically posting donation goals or treating the addon more as a hobby and seeking full time work with a company.
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Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 3:39 pm

Guest wrote:Redemption is not for everyone. You don't get to judge how you are redeemed.


A tad harsh I feel. He has admitted to his mistake, quickly apologised in the way he thought would get the apology to the Noscript/ABP userbase in the quickest way and has stated he is working on a more substantial apology. Look at this thread, when I checked it last night it was at ~5 pages, it's now more than triple that. Giorgio himself has replied in it many times between rushing out new versions of Noscript to remove the behaviour/features that caused this furor in the first place.
I was quite angry about this myself but seeing how hard Giorgio has worked on resolving the situation has made me see he's trying his best to sincerely make up for it and I decided to mentally give him a break, I implore you to do the same. Not to say that trust hasn't been lost but I'm seriously reconsidering reinstalling the extension due to the effort he's made recently.
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aZmoDen
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Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by aZmoDen » Sun May 03, 2009 3:49 pm

That is an excellent point. A little less rabbid hatred and a bit of a break will not only help someone out but will do yourself alot of good too.
Ever wondered why the angry and abusive people get hit health problems? if not for anyone else, do yourself a favour and get back to whats important in life.
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Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 4:24 pm

aZmoDen wrote:That is an excellent point. A little less rabbid hatred and a bit of a break will not only help someone out but will do yourself alot of good too. Ever wondered why the angry and abusive people get hit health problems? if not for anyone else, do yourself a favour and get back to whats important in life.


This too is an excellent point. A little more complacency and a bit continued "everything is fine" will not only help every out but will do you less good. Ever wondered how things got to be the way they are, that everyone falls in line and lets horrible things around them occur because they insist just that? If not for anyone else, do yourself a favour and get back to what's important in life. Living.
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Tester

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Tester » Sun May 03, 2009 4:38 pm

aZmoDen wrote:Ever wondered why the angry and abusive people get hit health problems?

Who would trust a person about computersecurity-issues any longer, if that person has repeatedly and forcefully and secretly misused our trust with full intention? Once a liar, always a liar... And even the apologies sound like: "Oh. I drove You car (without permisssion) and broke it (by intent!!!). Sorry (that I got caught)! As A SIGN OF MY GOOD WILL: I quickfix it for You. :O)"
OMG. What an ugly inside must one have to come up with such a thought and really believe that this is good as an apology...

To me it looks like if the author of Noscript will have much more time to focus on his $$$-job, his family-life and his health from now on.
So there is at least one good thing in the outcome of this eDrama.
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; de; rv:1.9.0.10) Gecko/2009042316 Firefox/3.0.10

Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 5:57 pm

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Giorgio Maone wrote:But please believe that it was made out of anger and hurry, rather than greed, since at that time literally everything was blocked by EasyList on my sites.

These filters were needed to block the ads on your site and because you kept changing them (and you still are changing them). Breaking a site of you was never intended but Ares needed to change the filters in this way only to block the ads.

That is Giorgio's right. Ares stepped over the line when he blocked everything because Giorgio was keeping one step ahead of him. Then Giorgio did a big no-no with his dicking around with the ABP code. However, Ares really should have his face in the dirt, like Giorgio, because he is the person who chose to escalate this time and time again.

He could just remove his redirect at this point and everything would have been ok then but he wanted the ads to be displayed at any cost.
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Alan Baxter
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Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Alan Baxter » Sun May 03, 2009 6:12 pm

Guest wrote:He could just remove his redirect at this point and everything would have been ok then but he wanted the ads to be displayed at any cost.

Interesting point of view. Mine is that Wladimir and Ares2 wanted to remove all ads from Giorgio's web site, at any cost, including breaking his web site until he capitulated. When his site was broken by the ridiculously broad filters used by Adblock Plus, Giorgio should have given up and asked his users and AMO for help. His mistake was trying to solve this on his own. A big mistake we're all paying for, especially him. A lot of good will come out of this, I hope, but it sure is a painful process.
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Guest

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Guest » Sun May 03, 2009 6:18 pm

Alan Baxter wrote:...including breaking his web site until he capitulated.

Again: that was a false positive and it was never intended.
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dan

Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by dan » Sun May 03, 2009 6:34 pm

Giorgio,
I believe that you apology should be to all users of NoScript, not just to ABP users. You weakened their trust of you, NoScript and firefox extensions. The beef was with ABP, but the wrong was to the whole community.

--dan
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id8

Post by id8 » Sun May 03, 2009 6:45 pm

Alan, that is my take, from what I have read.
It looks like he did this as a reaction to what Wlad and EasyList were doing?
in this context, there was a bit of "the heat of battle" involved in Giorgio's lapse,
it was a part of escalating silliness?

EasyList appears to have been working with Wladimir to mess up Giorgio?
When did this start?
Giorgio contacted Wladimir before this all happened?
Wladimir has not mentioned this communication, anywhere?

I appreciate Giorgio's reluctance to go on the attack in this situation, but
he has fallen on his sword, and the other side appears to merit some attention?

If there is more, I believe it should come out.

I also think he still should add a nag, ask for permission to whitelist his pages.
OSS need not be a vow of poverty.
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Re: Latest NoScript version (1.9.2) breaks Adblock Plus

Post by Giorgio Maone » Sun May 03, 2009 6:47 pm

dan wrote: I believe that you apology should be to all users of NoScript, not just to ABP users.

The Hackademix post I'm trying to finish is titled "Dear Adblock Plus Users, Dear Mozilla Community" in facts.
The moderators here can testify I told them about it yesterday in the "Asgard" restricted moderators forum.
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